Wednesday 28 May 2014


Readers may wonder if all this timetable detail is really necessary.  No, it is not necessary.  But for not a few of us model railroaders, it is intensely interesting and adds much to our enjoyment of the hobby.  In fact "Operations" is a hobby in itself with a very dedicated following who travel widely throughout the U S and sometimes to Canada to operations events several times a year.  I see it as a "super-detail" as valid as authentic paint schemes on locomotives or brake rigging on a freight car.  If we are going to operate, why not do it right?  In my experience, just running trains does not actually happen much, even on a completed layout.

Continuing with our commentary on the details of the CPR Timetable for the Carmi Subdivision, here is the bottom part of the page in question containing some of the "Special Instructions":

A few interesting things to note here are underlined.
For the "Big Tunnel", at Adra, Mileage 113.9, "Trains must not exceed a speed of 15 mph...".  This 1,604 foot tunnel turns through 218 degrees in a horseshoe curve according to Joe Smuin's records.  No surprise that a slower speed is required for such a long and tightly-curved tunnel.  With a friend I tried walking through it many years ago but could not see anything after proceeding into the darkness a few hundred feet.  Not even the proverbial hand in front of my face.  Without a serious flashlight, we could not continue even though we knew it was passable at the time.  Actually quite unnerving. 
"...freight trains descending grades between Chute Lake and Penticton must not exceed a speed of twenty miles per hour at any point."  It was a very long and steep descent that some crews found more worrisome than the Coquihalla grades.
"...thermal test..." refers to the requirement for trainmen to walk their train looking/feeling for excessive heat from brake-shoes which would have been applied for the duration of the descent.  They would be hot and even smoking on freights for sure, requiring two stops at Adra and Arawana to cool the wheels and brake-shoes.  Passenger trains, with their lighter train weight would only require one stop at Glenfir.  On the model a stop for a "thermal test" is something to imitate during operations as it adds to the realism and lengthens the run - always a good thing.

Here is a portion from the middle of the page with some underlines:
What are those letters to the right and left of the station names?  They are symbols used to indicate important information for the train crews.  Their meanings are specified in Rule 6 of the Uniform Code of Operating Rules (UCOR) which is listed below and explained here for the Carmi Sub.
Carmi station was featured in our last post.  It has Yard Limits denoted by the letter "Z" extending from both ends of the station, usually from the Mileboard.  Yard Limits included the main track and all other tracks between the yard limit signs.  Within yard limits, trains were permitted to operate without the need to send out flag protection against third and fourth class trains or extras.  They were required to proceed within yard limits at "yard speed" later known as "restricted speed".  They had to clear for first and second class trains.  See Rule 93.

Carmi also has a "W" which means it has a Water Supply.  Here are two water towers much like the one at Carmi.  One of them is a model!  Can you tell which one? 

The "C" stands for Fuel, whether coal or oil - in the case of Carmi for the last years of steam, both.  To the left of the station name is a mileage (Mi 46.6) as already explained.  

To the right is the car capacity of the siding and for Carmi it is a mere 21 cars.

In the far right column for First Class train No. 12 there is a tiny "s" in front of the time of 8.34 which means that Carmi is a Scheduled Stop at which the Kettle Valley Express will stop whether there are passengers to entrain or not.  If passengers were hoping to board the train at the previous stop of Lois, they would have to put out a " and white flag" (Rule 9d) to ask the train to stop; hence the "f" for Flag Stop.

At the McCullough station (call sign M C) there is a turning Wye and that is indicated by the letter "Y".  In this picture, Engine 3678 is backing on the West leg of the Hope Wye to turn and get in position to assist an Eastbound train up the Coquihalla.

At McCulloch there is another letter:  "R", meaning a Train Register is maintained there.  In this case, only freight train crews must register, whereas passenger trains do not.  The Special Instructions at the bottom of the page specify this (see above). This "Register Station" for freight trains, meant that the conductor had to enter the station and sign a Station Register Book with details and times of his train.  Here is a sample page from the Train Register we use at Brodie.  It is patterned after the prototype but much more concise.

Both Carmi and McCullough have yard limits but only McCullough has a call sign and thus an Operator to take Train Orders and "O S" passing trains.  Sometimes stations were only staffed for day-time hours and this is the case for McCullough as signified with a "D".  And it had a whopping 38 car siding! 

McCullough Turns.  Looking to the left of McCullough, to the second last column, there is a bold level line beneath the time of 18.20.  This indicates that daily freight No. 75 from Midway, terminates at McCullough.  For further details of this "infamous McCullough Turn" see Joe Smuin's Kettle Valley Railway Mileboards, page 1-28.   Robert D. Turner's book Steam on the Kettle has some interesting stories about it: pp 51-57.  With the complete changeover to diesel locomotives by 1954, the Train Order Office and Register were closed.

Our final symbol can be seen opposite "Penticton".  The letter "K" informs that "Standard Clock, bulletins and train register" are located here.  The precision of clocks and watches was mandated for all operating staff and they had to check and compare their watches every day.  Here is a picture of the one formerly at Revelstoke now in the museum.

In studying the Timetable, did you notice that No. 12, a first class train, is scheduled to meet No. 71, a fourth class freight, at Lakevale? The time is specified as 8.02 in the morning and perhaps you noticed that this time is in bold type in both columns to call attention to the meet.  More often than not, freight trains could not make their meets on time and would take a siding well before that to clear.  When No. 12 arrives at Lakevale, they  would not be obliged to wait for the freight as No. 12 is superior by class and can continue on their run safely presuming that No. 71 would be waiting for them on a siding closer to Midway.  On the other hand, if the freight had arrived on time for the meet (or early) at Lakevale, being inferior by class, they could not continue until No. 12 arrived, even if the passenger were many hours late.

Here is the full set of symbols set out in Rule 6 of the UCOR.  Credit:  Thank you Jeffrey P. Smith

6. The following symbols when used in the time table indicate:

* See footnote.
A Arrive.
B Bulletins and train register.
C Fuel.
D Day train order office.
F Flag stop to receive or discharge traffic.
K Standard clock, bulletins and train register.
N Night train order office.
P Telephone.
R Train register.
S Regular stop.
V Station protection signal. On both sides of station name indicates signals on both sides of station; when preceding station name, signal is east or south of that station; when following station name, signal is west or north of that station.
W Water.
X Crossover.
Y Wye.
Z Yard limit sign.

If you are new to this, that is a lot to learn; nevertheless, there's a test next week!

Coquihalla Man

Wednesday 21 May 2014


Today we look at the page for the Carmi Subdivision from the April, 1950 Timetable (No. 95).  It is identical to that of our target date of September, 1949 (No. 94) but much more legible.  For many years, Timetables were issued every six months in April and September usually with only minor changes but sometimes major schedule revisions.  Here is the full page of the Carmi Subdivision:

For modelers, prototype Timetables can supply a good deal of information in deciding what to model and how to plan for operations.  Of course there is a broad range of ideas as to how true to life a modeler wants to pattern his/her models and layout: from the generic to the specific to the fanciful.  I can only talk from my own perspective which is that of an historical modeler who, besides the big picture, likes to get most of the details right.  But, I am willing to bend a little on the timeline and other points of accuracy.  For example; the Romeo snowsheds were removed in 1945 or so, but with access to drawings, field work and historical photos, I decided to build one of them for my layout as a testimony to the skills of engineers and carpenters of one hundred years ago.  They are also very cool models.  But in the main, my layout is fairly accurate with regard to individual models, specific scenes, track-work, and to operations for September of 1949.
On the other hand, a recent layout tour in Model Railroader magazine featured the "Kettle Valley Railroad" and I must confess, that I gave the article only cursory attention as it was a very loose interpretation of the prototype.  There was some good model-building evident but this layout is a long way from my personal aspirations as a modeler.  Not complaining really: just contrasting styles.
Turning to the top of the Carmi page pictured below, we see the directions specified and their superiority/inferiority.  In the middle column are the first four stations along the line starting with Midway at Mile .0.  (Midway was treated in detail in two earlier posts.)  Explanations of the columns and headings follow with our annotations in red:

Reading down the "STATIONS" column then looking two columns to the left , we see that Kettle Valley is located at Mileage 8.9 measured from the centreline of the Midway depot to a designated spot at or near the station shelter.  The next station is Rock Creek which we treated in detail in an earlier post. This station Shelter building is 11.7 miles along the track from the Midway depot.  The number "2.8" above "ROCK CREEK" and below "KETTLE VALLEY" is the distance in miles between the two.  Similarly, the distance from Rock Creek to the next place along the line, "ZAMORA", is 7.3 miles bringing the total miles from Midway to Zamora to an even 19.0 miles.  These details help the Dispatcher and Crews in planning their moves and timings for meets.  It should be remembered that when a train was underway, there was only a slim chance of contacting the crew until the next open Train Order station.  These offices are designated in the column immediately to the right of the stations, where we see that (of these four stations) only Midway is able to handle "Telegraph and Telephone Calls".  Their call sign is "M I".  This call sign was used by Dispatchers as shorthand for the station on their Trainsheets and in the earlier days of the Telegraph, to call up the local Operator on the Telegraph Key.  Even in later days, there were occasions when telephone communication failed so that Dispatchers would resort to use of the Key.
In the next column is listed the car capacity of the siding, as another aid to crews and dispatchers in planning meets and passes.  In the case of Rock Creek, a cut of 36 cars could fit in the siding.  I have not determined if there is room beyond that for the caboose and locomotive(s).
On the left is a column which informs us that an Operator is on duty, either "D" for daytime or "N" for night-time or "DN" for both.  Then comes the aforementioned "Miles from Midway".  The next column to the left contains the times for Passenger train No. 11. the Kootenay Express.  It is due out of Midway at ten to seven in the evening (18.50).  Note that it is a First Class train and there are four other trains to the left which are designated as Fourth Class: Nos. 71, 73, 75, and 77.  All these Westbound trains hold odd numbers.  Eastbound trains are even numbers;  Hence the phrase: "Even-East".  This is the general convention for Canadian Pacific (and Canadian National) in BC.  All trains on this schedule are "Daily".  In other cases trains can be for example: Mon/Wed/Fri.
On the far right, there are no scheduled trains - just blank columns.  This indicates that all freight trains are run as extras.  The only scheduled Eastbound train is No. 12, called the Kettle Valley Express.  In this column, are the scheduled times for the train at each station listed.  This train cannot pass the station before the times listed even after arriving early.  For example, the markers on the tail end coach cannot pass the shelter at Rock Creek before 9.40 (a m).  In illustration of this, here we see No. 12's markers passing the station at Coquihalla with the Operator waving to the train crew after his "PK".  He will soon enter his shack to call the Dispatcher with the "O S" on No. 12 which is running 6 hours late; a fortunate happenstance that allows us to take this shot in the early morning light.

Back to the Carmi Sub; No. 12 is due at Midway at 10.05.  This is an arrival time as Midway is a terminal.  Again, the train can arrive before that time but not a good idea to be too early considering that other trains would be clearing for the train's scheduled time.  It also may result in a question from the Dispatcher as to the Engineman's haste over the line bearing in mind the speed restrictions which are outlined at the bottom of the Timetable page.  Unlikely to be crucial in the case of Beaverdell to Midway but certainly for a Westbound train on the long descent from McCullough to Penticton, the reported times might attract a little more attention as the "Special Instructions" contain many specific restrictions on speeds.

There is much more to say, so this commentary will be continued next week...

Coquihalla Man

Wednesday 14 May 2014


We continue our study of stations along the Carmi Subdivision with a post on Carmi Station. We have a few drawings and notes to share and a few thoughts.  A layout builder might want to incorporate the railway infrastructure of the station as part of a Carmi Sub layout in the steam era.   Carmi would not be quite so interesting from a modeler's viewpoint in the diesel era.  Incidentally, the name is pronounced CAR-MY.
Here is the Station Ground Plan from 1939 to 1949.
Things to note are the 2 pocket coal chute with its service track and an erasure which by its location would suggest that a sandhouse was removed at some point between 1939-49.  The Section House was surrounded by a fence which also enclosed the foreman's family privy.  Across from the house was the 20,000 gallon water tank.  The station dimensions are a little obscure but seem to be 24' x 16' with an operator's bay window and is set back from the front edge of the platform another 16' (to the main wall).  The platform, I calculate to be 90 feet long by 12 feet wide.  Note the telephone wire crossing to a pole near the station and I presume there is a drop to the station.  It looks like they had running water in the station supplied through a 3" pipe line from the water tank that ran on to the repeater station and dwelling across the tracks.  These latter buildings are still existent apparently.  Note the Butcher Boy Mining Claim in the lower right corner.  

During most of the days of steam, the coal and water supply at Carmi would mean that engines would often stop there on their way East to Midway which did not have a coaling plant.  Since the freight locomotives would turn at Midway for the return trip to Penticton they would need to top up their tenders here.  With the wholesale conversion of steamers to oil fuel in 1949, both Carmi and Midway received Bunker C oil tanks and stand pipes.  By the 1953 conversion of the Southern mainline to diesel locomotives, Carmi lost its status as a fueling point.  By that time, the terminal at Midway had received a diesel fuel oil installation as noted in an earlier post.  Here is an edited drawing of the Bunker C oil facility from June 15, 1949.  The coal chute is now called an "80 ton Coal Plant".  To its left are the oil fuel structures: from left to right UNLOADER, HEATED SUMP, PUMP HOUSE, SERVICE TANK.
And a little more detail below of the pump-house and service tank from a later plan dated Nov 19, 1951.  There is more to the plan which shows all four sides of the pump-house if anyone needs it.  Ironic to think that all these Bunker C facilities and locomotive conversions in 1949 would be made redundant in a mere four years with the rapid change to diesel-electric locomotives in 1953.

For further information on Carmi station, refer to Joe Smuin's KETTLE VALLEY RAILWAY MILEBOARDS, p1-21f.  In addition there is a good photo of the coal chute on the cover of his book: CANADIAN PACIFIC'S KETTLE VALLEY RAILWAY (BRMNA).  Some excellent photos taken by Gib Kennedy appear in Robert D. Turner's book STEAM ON THE KETTLE VALLEY, pp. 50 and 56.  Gib Kennedy took these photos in the last years of steam; perhaps 1948 going by the coal-fired engine 5230.  If my memory is right, I understand that he was working there as an (relief?) operator at the time.  There is a glimpse or two of the section house, coal chute and water tower.  Unfortunately, there are no shots of the station.  On page 56, Turner mis-identifies a building as the station that is actually the section house.  Photos of the Section House are available from GTC Collectibles taken by Stan Styles in 1960?  It was in better shape than when Hal Riegger took some shots in 1974 and here is one of them courtesy of the Okanagan Archive Trust Society. That is a standard Sectionman's bunkhouse in the foreground.  Three shorter bunkhouses are beyond the foreman's house.  The white post supports a mailbox for the crews of the way-freights that would obtain the waybills for the cars from the nearby sawmill(s).  There was no agent here, so I assume the sawmill clerks would deposit them.  Comment/correction anyone?
large photo Another photo can be viewed at:

Finally, I should mention that the sawmill at Carmi was still standing when I visited the site in the late 1980's.  It was a good size and even had a Kiln for drying their lumber.  It was clad in metal to retain the heat.  The mill had been abandoned and someone had chainsawed out most of the main ceiling joists which were quite substantial.  Their removal made the structure unsound and even precarious so it was no surprise to me to learn that it was eventually torn down.  I believe this would have been the Olinger family sawmill.  Unfortunately, no photos were taken by me on that visit.  On page 256 of John Garden's book, THE CROW AND THE KETTLE, a way-freight is shown switching boxcars in 1968 but the mills are not visible - just trees and tracks.

Next post will treat of the Timetable for the Carmi Sub with some comments and explanations.

Wednesday 7 May 2014


Rock Creek station was a scheduled stop for passenger trains on the Carmi Sub until 1957.  In studying the "station ground plans" with the several industrial structures that suggest a fair amount of activity in this area, it would make sense that there was a population to work these industries and that might access the passenger services.  The village itself is situated on the West side of the Kettle River across from the railway which is running roughly North-west.  This is another station on the KV that would make for a very interesting module on its own or as part of a layout.  For additional information, refer to Joe Smuin's excellent guide:  Kettle Valley Railway Mileboards on page 1-12f.

Below we show three parts of the original drawing: the East, centre and West sections of the station area.  The drawing itself is quite large and the rule at the bottom of the pages is a condensed inch rule as these drawings were originally drafted in a scale of 1":100'.  When they were copied for us by the CPR engineering department, they had already been condensed when transferred into microfiche format so I made sure to include the scale when photocopying and reducing them  for scanning purposes.  The scale was outside the border and had to be cut and pasted to the plan.

East End with Title Block.
Things to note:  Drawing originally dated Oct 23, 1933 and updated in 1945, and 1948.  A faint hand shows a date of April 23, 1959 which may be the time that the name of the Imperial Oil dealer was added near to the Standard Oil Co. name, its predecessor.  On the far left and in this more recent hand is a label reading "Ramp for Camp McKinney Gold Mines Ltd." although no dimensions or footprint are given for the ramp - only a property lease demarcation of 60' x 44.5'.  At extreme right a private siding is drawn in having been installed for "C T Loewen" dated 1948.  This is likely the Cooke Lumber Company that Joe Smuin mentions in his book at Mileage 11.2.  There are several buildings that are standing today: notably the sawmill building and beehive burner as well as other outbuildings.  These are all plainly visible on Google Earth including a street view of the mill area.  Our photos date from June, 2013.

Mill Building

   Saw-filer/Garage/Maintenance Building?

Centre Section.

Here we see the Station building drawn in with a cinder platform.  This appears to be the original building that Smuin describes as hosting an agent-operator until 1931 or so in addition to serving the public.  The photo in his book reveals a replacement structure that was erected in 1961.  There is a another good photo of it taken in 1964 by Stan Styles - which includes the section foreman's house - published by GTC Collectibles: CPR-ROCKCR-1.
Here is a photo dated 1915, of the original station from the Okanagan Archive Trust Society: 
 large photo

This station measures 16.4' x 36.3'.  The cinder platform measures 14' x 64' and is set back 8 feet from the centreline of the track.  Note the telephone drop for the agent to the station.  The Section House and its outbuildings (including a pump-house) are surrounded by a fence as is the whole of the railway right-of-way, this being denoted by the dashed and dotted lines.  The fuel and gas tanks for the Bulk oil dealer would have been located inside the berm that is drawn in the lower left corner of the fenced-in quadrangle.  Not sure what the platform and shed represent but would guess that they were part of the oil dealer buildings.  Inside the compound are indecipherable lines and numbers.  To the right is a Stockyard on the CPR property and to the left is what appears to be another Stock-pen with a scale, this time outside the CPR property.  The ubiquitous Tie Loading Platform is pictured with ramps at each end. One day we will provide some detail on platforms and ramps in general.

West End.
In this section are the small buildings characteristic of many CPR sidings: tool shed, privy, bunkhouse, and some small sheds near the road.  Note the cross-bucks (X-ing sig.) and cattle guards (C G) drawn in at the public road crossing on the West end.  There is a "Private Crossing" close to the station (no cross-bucks here - just a warning sign) and houses drawn outside the CPR boundaries.   At the bottom is the road bridge to the village.  The siding itself has # 11 switches while the double ended back track has # 9's.  The sawmill spur takes off from the mainline with a # 11 switch.  On one or two station ground plans in my collection, I note that # 9 switches were being upgraded to # 11's on the mainline.  I believe this occurred in the 1950's.  Of course we modelers cannot usually replicate this as we are constantly dealing with space constraints and sharp curves.  In my case, I have adopted a # 7 standard for the switches on my layout as has a fellow "Kettle-ite".  And of course, we have the CPR drawings for a prototype # 7 switch.  We built many by the old one-off method but a few years ago we acquired the Fast Tracks jigs which are superb accessories that we highly recommend. 

We should note that one mile to the South (railway East) at mileage 10.2 was a log-loading spur for Oliver Sawmills - 664 feet long according to Smuin.  Eventually, we will treat in detail of the railway service to the logging industry.  Again, this KVR station could make an interesting and enjoyable scene on a layout with a fair amount of switching variety: stock cars, gondolas for ties, tank cars, ore cars, flats or box cars for lumber and with the log spur to the south, a string of log flats.

Coquihalla Man

Thursday 1 May 2014


Beaverdell is a tiny settlement near the right of way of the former Kettle Valley Railway.  It was a station 42 railway miles north-west of Midway and people still live in the neighbourhood.  Looking at the satellite images available through Google Earth, one can easily discern the former railway grade for the most part though there are a few intrusions due to later industrial activity.  By keying in Beaverdell and then looking to the west of the highway, the right of way and the approximate locations of the former buildings can be detected or calculated.  Zooming in with "Street View" one can follow the Beaverdell Station Road that runs west from the highway.  It crosses what appears to be a relocated railway girder bridge spanning the West Kettle River, passes a baseball diamond and then a truss-building plant close to the right-of-way.  The main industrial building of the truss plant shows on the right of the photograph below.  The central feature of this photo is the ore loading ramp for the ores shipped out by the Highland Bell Mine.  The gravel road to the left is the former right-of-way.  This shot dates from about 1985.

With a young family, I did not have a very large hobby budget so I had to scrimp on photography costs with the result that I took only two photos when our family passed through the area on our way to a Nelson high school reunion.  How regrettable that I could not afford a few more shots of the unique and interesting buildings, especially the concentrator.  Here is a photo of the Highland Bell Mill building.  Close examination under magnification reveals a company sign:  Highland Bell with the word "TECK" in 
larger print, followed by Corporation.  High on the right is what appears to be an unloading shed with cribbing for a ramp for trucks to dump their raw ores for processing in the ball mill.

We also offer here a black and white image of the other side of the concentrator from a book by John White entitled DRIVING THE KETTLE VALLEY, published on a small scale in 1994.  I hope he has no objection to my sharing this image.  It could be very helpful to modelers.  If he or anyone else has more photos or information to share, please contact me at or in the comments section below.

The station with its tie loading platform and Mill seems an eminently model-able station for a layout and here is a CPR drawing and some details to assist one in that endeavour. For scaling purposes, note that there are dimensions on the drawing of 50 feet on each side of the centreline of the mainline and a further 100 feet dimension given for the boundary near the mill.  The actual footprint dinmensions of the mill are given including the distance to the centreline of the spur to the mill building itself.  One can only speculate what items were shipped or received in freight cars through the large doors in the photo above.  The date of this drawing is not provided but my guess is that it would probably have been revised and updated about 1950.

Here is an enlargement of the concentrator showing clearly many important dimensions.  Of interest is the No. 11 spring switch and the derail on the siding.  The little triangle attached to the track centre-line is the symbol for a derail.  The diamond is the symbol for a headblock/switch stand with the letters "P. S." denoting Point of Switch.  The pair of dotted lines is the symbol for a culvert which seems to have been filled with drain rock in 1935.  Note also that the Mill is outside the railway property.  There are two 50' dimensions for scaling if necessary.

Here is some detail of the other structures and their locations.  Again, there is a 100 foot dimension with which the drawing can be scaled.  Incidentally, the little dots linked by a solid line are the locations of telephone poles which are all located inside railway property.  Interesting detail.  And there is a fence line bordering the right-of-way for the entire length of the drawing. 

Regarding the cattle corral on the railway property to the left, it appears to say "Woven Wire Fence" with dimensions of 35' x 50'.  This suggests another load to be shipped from Beaverdell but how did they load cattle into stock cars from the corral?  At the Tie Loading Platform of course we would expect Gondolas would be loaded.  I believe that flatbed trucks with ties would drive up the ramp onto the platform at one end and exit by way of the other ramp to avoid a backing movement.  The tie mills themselves would be located in the bush near the supply of timber.  The "Bell Mill Ore Chute" is the one shown in the photo above.  I have no info on the station other than what is reported in Joe Smuin's MILEBOARDS.  This station is a mere 15 feet square so I suspect that it was a simple frame shelter with a 50' cinder platform.  On the other hand, Joe Smuin reports that an agent/operator functioned there from 1935 to 1969 and a wire drop does appear to connect to the station.  Call sign "BD" appears on all my Timetables.  The presence of a "double privy" suggests there was actually passenger traffic.  This is confirmed by the denotation in the Timetables of Beaverdell as a "scheduled stop" for Nos. 11 and 12.  Finally, the "woodshed" also suggests that a stove was provided for the "comfort" of the agent/operator and any waiting passengers.   A photo and caption in MILEBOARDS shows a later station building (and train order board) that had been erected about 1959.  It is similar to a section bunkhouse with a width of 10 feet.  These were portable structures capable of being transported on a flat car.

Finally, we have a link to an article with a good deal of information and a superb photo which was sent to me by a blog correspondent:   
Here is the photo courtesy of the Okanagan Archives Trust Society:
In fact, it was Colin's input and questions which moved me to consider this post.  Movies of a Way-freight doing switching will have to wait.  So, if you have a pet subject regarding the KVR on which I might have info, you can write me.  Sorry for the tardiness of this post but a wedding anniversary trumps a model railroading post.

Coquihalla Man